I have a problem. No it is not indigestion (It SO is), but the fact that every thing I love is getting too fucking mainstream.

Here are some examples:

Nintendo, When I was a little boy, I had a gamecube. Nobody else had and I felt special. Now every old cunt has a frigging Wii and acts like she's all the gamer.

Deadpool, Not quite really mainstream yet, but I'm sure that after the new Deadpool movie he'll be the new wolverine.

The Beatles, Ofcourse in the seventies they were very mainstream. But these days nobody listens to the beatles no more. Now they remastered everything and with the new beatles rockband, I'm quite sure that this will become mainstream.

AIDS, First nobody had AIDS.... Alright I'll stop now.


My point is: Arent you annoyed that everything you love is getting mainstream. That every retard who watched something for two days now acts like he's the expert.
What do you think.

Whenever somebody walks up to me and tells me they're the expert on Resident Evil or Silent Hill, I ask them about the most obscure things in those games. If they can't answer me, I have proven to them that they are NOT the experts they claim to be.

Honestly, yes, people like that do piss me off. I've had people tell me that Tarja never left Nightwish, that it's the other way around and that Anette left. Yeaaahhhh...

*nods *

All my favourite music is becoming popular, which kinda sucks, because once a band goes mainstream, they'll change their sound to fit popular media, making me a sad clam.

I have no idea what you're talking bout, but I will still agree with you.


No clam should ever be sad

My girl friend would agree whole heartedly. When something you love gets picked up the masses, it is crap. The thing that makes the stuff cool was the fact that it was individual to you. And now that everyone else is doing it, it's like their stealing your identity.

Personally, I think that's crap. What makes you unique IS the stuff you like, regardless of what anyone else thinks. And letting yourself be swayed by the mainstream, either to like something because is popular, or not to like something because it's popular is to be swayed by the masses.

Why are you competiting with people who follow the ebs and flows of the popular movements, they'll move on, you're beloved classics will have a few touch ups, and you'll be able to continue on with your uniqueness.

You can't rage because your beloved uniqueness is the fad of the month <.< You're letting "THEM" get to you... you're letting "Them" win!

I'm afraid of them.

And if them make something more mainstream I will not stop listening or watching that thing, unless that thing changes due to being popular.

It's not that; it seems like whenever obscure bands become mainstream, they begin to change to please the masses and end up sucking. Bad.

@Bast: Meaning, ever since RE and SH had movies, the games have become more mainstream. Hence, people acting like they're experts.

Yes, I got that. I just didnt understand anything from that little Silent Hill talk.
All I know that there's a guy name Pyramid Head.

Let's put it this way: I get idiots telling me that Pyramid Head only belongs to James from SH2, and that he had no business being in the movie. Granted, PH didn't make a debut until SH2, but he did have a small appearance in SH3 in a painting of the executioners from centuries before the game. SH4, he wasn't in it. Homecoming, he was in it AS HIS EXECUTIONER SELF. Anybody who is a die-hard SH fan knows that Pyramid Head is the punisher of Silent Hill.
If you have done something crazy enough - like say, killing your sick wife out of "mercy" but you were doing it so you could be free - he will lure you there and chase you until you either repent or die.

Usually? You die after you repent. Alex from Homecoming was just one lucky bastard, unless you got the bad ending where he becomes one.

Yea, it can get annoying. BUT, Warhammer 40k thankfully isn't falling to that

That makes sense.

It's not so much that everyone else likes it, but more the fact that the thing (movie, music, game, etc...) tends to change. It's no longer what you started liking in the first place. That's what pisses most people off about the fad changes. They move from one thing to another and ruin it for those who liked it before it became popular.

For instance, horror movies. When was the last time you saw a good horror movie? Now all you see are psych-thrillers that suck, crappy remakes that almost shame the original all together, slashers that pale in comparison to the old grindhouse flicks, b-movies that try to be more than they are...

The Others was the last good one I can remember, though that was not strictly horror.

But people eat that crappy horror shit up.

You forgot parodies of horror/thriller movies.

Exactly.

Ugh...I don't even consider that horror. Personally not a fan of the psych-thriller unless it can make me jump.

And they do it because they think it's cool to be seen at a horror movie even if it's crap >.<
I'll go see some of them if they look promising, but if it sucks I'm not gonna go see it 5 more times just because it's "cool."

Although I will that there something entertaining about a b-movie that knows it's a b-movie. They play it up and make you want to watch it.


Parodies still count as comedy

Well...I think you picked three huge topics that were already mainstream. Perhaps not there in the Netherlands, but here in the U.S....very mainstream. And for the record, I was listening to the Beatles probably before you were born. I still don't like them.

But like Green Day? Nirvana? All those before they became mainstream sounded better. So did a lot of other stuff.

I had an interview with a game developer about why is it now days gaming is popular and "cool" where as not even 10 years ago, you were a computer geek/nerd if you played video/computer games. His answer was interesting, but it's not approved to publish yet

Shit, Even this thread is getting mainstream.

I sure do hope it doesnt change to fit the opinion of the masses.

...You mean I'm not the only one?



lol

Sorry, It istn mainstream here. Well nintendo ofcourse is now. But hardly anyone listens to the beatles anymore. It is all rap and stuff like that

I don't listen to rap or "stuff like that" myself. For the most part it lacks in any true musical quaility and I listen to almost everything, having worked in radio at one point in my young adult life (that was fun too). However, I can tell you in my office of 35 somewhat people, more than half have Beatles on their iTunes. So to say that no one listens to the Beatles anymore is a very inaccurate opinion stated as a fact.

AROUND HERE.

That is the netherlands. Where noone listens to the beatles.
Except old people. And me. And a really weird smelly kid. Ooh wait, that is also me.

Luckily for me this hasn't happened to me yet, that's probably because i usually like stuff that was mainstream years ago or never was and probably never will be and sometimes i find a like something that was just mainstream but has been effectively abandoned. But i see the passing fads and i think develop a personality you brain dead fools. It's pathetic but it'll never change, there will always be those who find it easier for others to think for them or just lack the creativity that they have to try and 'express' themselves through other people.

Learn to like what others don't.

For Example:
Sniffing asbestos, nobody does that because they like the use of their lungs.
But you can break that band wagon, you can be the one.

Try being a hipster like my brother. Hipster culture is nomadic. What I mean by that its that they'll listen to obscure indie bands and then be forced to abandon them once those bands have songs that get played on radio or in movie trailers and move on to new obscure bands to listen to. Case in point: Vampire Weekend.
I don't think you can argue that the Beatles have ever been anything but mainstream. That's bullshit to say that you liked them and then they got popular. They were popular before you were born.

I usually do not mind when something I enjoy goes main stream.

Too many stuff i enjoyed were ignored my the main stream and died out way too quickly.

Ogre Battle being on of them... Battle toads have just recently turned mainstream, too late imo.

1st off, Game Cubed sucked, which is why nobody else had one...
2nd: Aids? really...
3: You kids need to get over the fact that things become popular, stop trying to identify yourselfs with something OTHER people or organization has come up with, for the purpose of becoming mainstream and making money!!! If you like something other people like then be happy your not a outkast....

The court agrees the Gamecube did suck.
And its Marvel's fault that they have to find characters they like and plaster them in every damn comic, they'll have a comic soon that focuses on Deadpool, Wolverine, and Spider-Man going on Entourage-type adventures in Europe and everyone will buy it and love it.

I was watching porn long before it went mainstream, And have been using wheels long before you sheep started using them

Dude, I meant NOW. In the 21st century. IN THE NETHERLANDS. In a small stupid village that nobody gives a f cuk about.


ALRIGHT. I never said anything about the beatles.

If you only liked something because people didn't know about it, you didn't really like it. You liked having a secret. If something changed when it got popular, well, things change anyway. In the twenty some years Warhammer products have been made, they've never approached mainstream culture very closely and the games have changed considerably. Things change.

Really, it just comes down to people wanting to have a cry because they lost their secret or they want to blame something for a change in the thing they enjoyed. Unless you're buying new Pokemon games, stuff will change.


There are plenty of things that change without ever becoming mainstream as well.

Mostly, people just bitch because it changed. Or they bitch because it hasn't changed. Ideally, every creative team would do things true to their own vision but that's not going to help with popularity - the Star Wars prequels were a lot closer to Lucas' artistic vision than the original trilogy.

Nintendo is a different case. The problem there is that Nintendo abandoned their old demographic because the non-hardcore market is much larger and games like Guitar Hero had eased the stigma on games considerably. Of course, Nintendo as a company has always done this. It's why it's so successful. Their primary market is Japan so they aim to sell in Japan. After that, they almost always aimed away from serious and quality games unless they were designed for the Japanese market (like the Zelda games). The gaming community outside of Japan has always been secondary to Nintendo.


Being fair to the genre, that's not because it's rap. Most music lacks true musical quality.

And it's not like musical quality has any correlation with popularity. For my part, I can enjoy good classical music but I really enjoy Nickelback. That's not to suggest Nickelback has much in the way of musical talent, I just like what they do.


Yeah, I had a friend who spent two years as a hipster. He didn't bother listening to real bands, he just kept making up names that sounded like obscure bands and had an air of vague superiority. He fit right in.

Short answer:
Who gives a fuck?

Seriously. Not trying to pick on your or anything, but why are you so worried about whether the stuff you like turns mainstream? It's not like you're going to lose your personal identity if others suddenly catch on to the awesomeness of the things you liked long before they.

Who gives a crap if it's mainstream? If you like it, you like it. The fact that a lot of other people now like it too shouldn't even be a factor. You don't even need a good reason to like it, as long as you're not shoving your opinion down others' throats.

It doesn't matter if it's popular or not. Popularity doesn't mean shit to anyone with half a brain and the ability to form their own opinion. Don't worry so much about what others think.

Mainstream doesn't always suck and the new underground band no one's heard of yet isn't always good. Again, popularity means little. It isn't a thermometer that measures quality.

Shit changes. You may like the changes, you may not, but it's gonna happen. Get used to it.

But I dont like changes....

Like I said, get used to it. I don't particularly like change either, but you have to learn to deal with it.

You can either roll with the changes, or get rolled over by them.

You can also learn to like them. Things you like may disappear or be so greatly changed you don't like them any more, but there's always more out there from which to choose.

It just occurred to me that I'm listening to You Should Be Dancing by the Bee Gees while responding to this topic.
I love the Bee Gees. I don't care if they're considered old. They still rock.

I also want to point out. Those things that you love were made by someone, and it would nice of you to actually be happy that through all the good times they've given you, they're being rewarded, and good providers don't let their true fans down in the end, they just now have more resources and opportunities to do things they couldn't before!

Meh i don't really like the bee gee's myself, i find them squeaky and annoying, but that's what you like and i'm fine with that. but music is a funny area for me, if someone came up to me and was like "OH MY GOD YOU HAVR TO HERE THIS NEW TRACK BY *blank* ITS AWESOME AND THEIR THE BIGGEST THING RIGHT NOW" and i listen and thought it was crap I'll tell them straight i think its crap but at the same time i don't hate them for liking it. BUT then there's the problem with certain music like club and r&b, to me club is just creative plagiarism and the same five beats on repeat, r&b is wailing down a mic and a similarly basic beat as club, also for me Rap is vocal technique, hip hop is idiots talking about how they live in the poorest pert of town then blew their chance to move away on making their car look like a rich clowns car. My opinions on music are very conflicting at times and as for other thing becoming mainstream i dont really care.

tl;dr: i'm a bit of a hypocrite and quite self centered apparently

My personal definition of shit getting too mainstream.

Thank god that Slayer will not become mainstream again nothing like good old trash lol, but i do kinda agree with the whole mainstream thing that is going on atm, it sucks.

It makes me very sad. I came across someone making 4chan references and they didn't even know what 4chan was.

i hope to god you educated them with a link to the worst thing in 4chan you could find, newfags, lol

Media Watchdogs whine about anything that is popular that deviates even slightly from their very warped moral perspective and they like to use astroturfing to convince government bodies to enforce that perspective.

For those unfamiliar with the term, astroturf refers to a fake grass-roots movement.


Yeah, it's terrible that the hobby has reached unprecedented levels of acceptability and popularity. After all, nobody will ever get tired of the dumbed down fare that drew them in. People never find they like something and search for a better, more sophisticated version of that thing.

They had the same problem with cars, you know. Unfortunately, when cars became popular it was the end of them. Nobody in our society ever wants to invest in something so crass as profit.


Yes, because it's a travesty people aren't familiar with that.

It's like all of those people who aren't familiar with spray-painting C&B on billboards. They're missing high art.

I think that what 'kills' something, isn't its large fanbase, it's when fame or money are valued more than the art's quality or message, it loses its 'soul', in a way.

hahah nice...

Fame and money are always valued in any society. There's no virtue in refusing either of them, though.

10% of all artistic endeavours approach greatness, if we're being optimistic. If there's no money and no fame involved, there are very few people even remotely interested in the field. Mostly, they'll apply the same talents elsewhere. You see more people trying to write song lyrics than poetry because music has fame and money where poems don't. So when something becomes mainstream, yes, the absolute numbers greatly increase and you end up with plenty more shit.

Except the ratio doesn't change.

One of the best ways to accomplish fame and money is to be good at what you're doing. Skill doesn't come with fame and money, but a lack of fame and money is no indicator of skill. There's a very weak correlation between them at most.

I think you must be young...the overuse of anglo saxon vernacular to make your points look "cool" and "shpecial" gave you away.

I can't say I appreciate your overgeneralization of gamer-girls being clueless cunts. I've played video games for more than 20 years. I have played Atari, 3D0, SuperNintendo, GameCube, PS2, PS3 and Xbox. None of which makes me cool. NOT playing a Wii yet doesn't make me cool either. I like what I like, and I don't give a wet slap if someone else likes or dislikes it. IMHO, It's very sad when a person feels they must change themselves to fit in (or fit out!) with the herd.

As for the Beatles, they are legend. Can't say I like all their music, but my husband was raised on 'em and can't get enough.

And if you REALLY want to have AIDS to be outside of the crowd...wow.

If you like Deadpool, keep likin' him. I prefer Wolverine, and I liked him long before the films came out. But even if I hadn't, it doesn't matter that he went "mainstream"...he's beyond cool by any standard.

Cheers...

Verbose, I think you're failing to see the point or you're just debating for the sake of debate. For some people, yes it's just because the thing became popular, but not for all people. Yes, change does happen, but not all change is good. When a band starts out, they have a loyal group of fans who will follow their careers to the end, but once they become mainstream they tend to change to better appeal to the people making them popular and bringing them more money. While this isn't necessarily bad for them to strive for success and wealth, it is bad that they changed their own artistic vision to fit someone else's idea of what's good. They already had plenty of people who liked them and they would have built their wealth eventually, but they allowed the fad popularity to go to their heads and change who they were into someone they wouldn't recognize anymore. You can't just explain it all away as the original fans are just afraid of change. Sometimes the change should never have happened and sometimes it's for the better, but which one depends on the situation.

What i hate most about the mainstream is the retards who follow it, the ones who have to be told what to like, like you liked a band for a while and you liked them for their message or their tunes and rhythms of their songs made you fell good and 'touched' you as it were, then they become mainstream and some idiot come up to you and is like "Oh yeah i like them too, they're deep." and you try to be nice and start a conversation about that and maybe some other music you like and they turn out to not have a clue what they're talking about, it's sad and it makes me sad

This wouldn't be new.


In all likelihood, they were already doing this to an extent to begin with. In most endeavours, we learn first by imitating. We mimic the things we like as best we can and by doing this we feel out the shape of it. For art, especially, our emotional state plays heavily into what we enjoy and express. There's never a particular point where Fame and Wealth have been achieved, being that it's a gradual process, but I disagree with the notion that changing their artistic expression because of this is bad.


This is a common thought when a band(/whatever) changes but I think that's reading too much into motives that an audience simply isn't privy to. Sometimes it's not fame that demands artistic overhaul but artistic sensibilities. This is equally as common when fame and money (hereby referred to as fameny) have been achieved. When art is actualised, it's not simply for the sake of art and I call any artist who says it is a liar.

They create for themselves, perhaps, but they share for others. After all, if the Beatles only ever wanted to create music for the sake of music they could have simply stayed happy doing it in their garage. Some people do. I know a couple of people who are quite happy in a crappy little band in a garage somewhere not trying to do anything other than enjoy making music with friends.

So back to the issue directly. Band A has reached a point where they're becoming well-known. They have a medium-sized fanbase, mostly centred around the state they came from. The only reason to think Band A needs to keep making music to please their fans is if their music is a commercial matter. I think that's why I have a problem listening to people claim that the fameny is what changed x's art. Fameny is what would keep it the same. You pointed it out yourself - if they keep rehashing the same ground with any skill, they will eventually achieve even more fameny. Look at television. There is a lot more profit and a lot less risk involved in rehashing the same stories. Look at mainstream comic continuities where nothing substantial ever happens or changes - they keep their fans happy by refusing to allow significant change.

Except that's stagnation, mostly. It's why quality drops off for a lot of artists/music/shows/books. Oh, and of course this completely opposite problem is the fault of fameny as well. See, any change you don't like is caused by fameny and any changes you want that don't get made is also fameny. Since what people like is incredibly subjective (and I would argue only very loosely connected to what is good), it's nice that every single facet of everything can be equally explained by fameny ruining it.


And I wouldn't. I've lost interest in things because it went in a direction I didn't like. A bunch of times it happened because I wasn't interested in the fairly common direction it decided to go down. I've never tried to claim that people have to like changes or that all complaints are just fear of change.

People bitching about mainstream, though, is just that. It's bitching and it carries a few very arrogant assumptions with it that I think are patently false.


Yeah, exactly. This is why nobody can enjoy novels until they at least have a bachelor's degree in English Literature! It's not okay for somebody to like something for no particular reason, or to think that something has particular depths if you don't know every inch of them personally.

I don't see why you complain? think if all these people didn't buy and use these products then they wouldn't get the money to make more or keep going.
It's the same thing with bands and calling them sell outs and mainstream, what happened to being happy for their success? instead of the "oh I listened to them before they were famous, way before you" and start "oh cool, you like them too? I'm glad they're making a name for themselves" its what they want and the reason they make the products is to sell them if you were the only one buying them, don't expect it to be around for long
in other words, get over yourselves.