I've always wanted to create my own fantasy stories. One of my problems is that I'm very much a perfectionist with too much pride. I cant create something half-assed. If I where to create something, I only want to create one epic tale. So I've recently started thinking about what's needed to build up a epic story. This place seemed to consist of book readers and fantasy-fans, so I couldnt think of a better place to bring up the discussion. I've always had a pre-love for stories that take place in medieval environments with magic and fierce monsters, so that's what I'm gonna concentrate on here, other ideas of other natures are of course apreciated aswell.

What's needed to create a full fledged fantasy story and what can enchant it? Here are some of my ideas.

A antagonist and a protagonist. (Of course)
A unique world.
Races with diffrent traits.
It's own legends, myths and history.
Gods and/or higher beings of some kind.
Dragons! (Dragons are the spawns of awsomeness)
Special powers and magics in alot of diffrent kinds.

I know I've left alot of stuff out, but this is asmuch as I can come to think of as I'm writing this. I hope we can add to the list with ideas and suggestions together.

Dragons can be over-played, so don't include them where they're not needed for the sake of making a mediocre scene h4rdc0r3.

One thing I've always liked is subtle foreshadowing. Since it sounds like you want to make something quite long, spanning a few volumes I assume, that'll give you plenty of room.

Other than that, I'd recommend you post a small portion to get a few opinions on what should be revised and some weak points you might have.

Character development. Every great story has a character that people can relate to, and often another they aspire to be. For example, in Lord of the Rings, those people were Frodo and Aragorn. Frodo was extremely human; he was willing to take on the tasks set before him, but was continualy found to be with weakness and in need of help. He failed. This made him much more "real" in my mind. Aragorn on the other hand was a great, intimidating man. He was skillful at many things, well traveled and well read. He inspired, both in words and in deeds. He was strategic, knowledgable, humble, a skilled warrior, and willing to sacrifice himself, among other traits. I don't know a single person who doesn't wish they had at least one of Aragorn's qualities.

This is the essence of a "great" story. While you can have a great thriller of a book that is a page turner and a good read, for it to be truly epic you need the characters. At least in my humble opinion, being an amateur writer that cant create characters worth CRAP

As much as character development is important you can go too far sometimes, look at Drizzt and Cadderly.

Yeah, the guys here at LFG could make their own little Inklings club. Feel free to post a work in progress. Or, if you like, you can bounce thoughts around with us writer to writer. I believe we have at least 5 writers around here.

What hits me as a great story is believability. Having the protagonist win against great odds is a hard thing to make believable, but it really makes a story for me. Flesh out the world, and don't tell every story. It's the depth of Lord of the Rings that makes it so entertaining. And how did he make it so deep? For one, Tolkien MADE new languages for his races (not just revised english either ; ) and his first story (The Silmarillion) ended up being his backstory. With that in place, everything already existed and had a reason to be there. No retconning =]

Also, if you're going for "save the world" epic, you'll need to spend some time thinking about who is on what side and why. In my own story, the big bad evil guy is quietly taking control over the groups of people that have access to magic. Once he has them by the throat, the world is his, resistance or not. Unfortunately, he hasn't counted on the one person who knows exactly who he is and exactly what he's doing. At the risk of being called for free advertising, I'll drop a link to mine. I'll warn you, I'm no great and wonderful writer of my own right (working on it =D), but it does give you a chance to see what a story looks like that's just homebrewed, no editors, no publisher, no nothin'.

http://lfgcomic.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=1342

Your characters need to have real personalities too, nobody wants to read a story where the main character acts like a robot, even if it is a robot.

Most of all the story needs to flow. I refuse to read certain peoples essays at my school because I know they're going to be choppy and will not flow at all. It gives me a headache.

Dragons are, like I said, spawns of awsomeness. Therefor they should only be used in scenes that peaks the excitment. =)
The main thing that I want to create and will put the most effort into is creating the world where everything takes place. Rather then making alot of volumes, I would like to make stand-alone books that take place in the same world.

I think I'm gonna need more planning before I actually start writing anything. As I'm writing this a plot is actually starting to building up in my head. Gonna polish it up a bit before I present it to you guys.

I would write a couple stories based in the real world before creating a new world, that way you can focus more on character development and plot design and less on the creation of your realm.

True indeed. I might try doing that. It's still gonna have to be super-natural in some way, or I wouldnt be able to find the will do write it. lol

By all means, nobody said not to make it a fantasy novel, just try not to make it an emo novella full of effeminate vampires and a necrophiliac heroine.

thats actually the route ive taken. i figured creating a backdrop for the story would be much easier than trying to figure out where everything goes after the fact. One of the recurring annoyances ive run in to is naming. while coming up with names is always hard (well okay not always), sometimes you make up a name for something and you like it and its really good and then you're reading someone else's work and theres that name. you know you've never read this before or seen that name before, at least not conciously, but there it is. kinda frustrating, at least to me. usually its in something small, like i have a town with the same name as a river in Beleriand (if you dont know where that is you certainly wont know what river im talking about).

Hey! I was just thinking about making it a emo style vampire novel. Now it would feel like it was your idea if I wrote it! lol

I wrote a parody emo vampire story I'd post it but it's kinda NSFW. I will however post this bit.

"Vince, my darling come let us brood together, make the two of us one!"

"But Eliza, I'm the undead, it would be necrophilia."

"I don't care, I love you"

"You're a sick fuck."

What I would start with is making a rough map over the world, so you have a basic idea of where everything is located. Dont have to start naming everything just yet. Perhaps make some points of intrest, mountains and roads.

Having an awesome scene and THEN adding dragons is pure gold. So long as it makes sense, it's absolutely incredible.



LFG should seriously consider having a writers subforum since so many of us enjoy it.

I don't know what it is, but I have a serious problem with dragons. It just makes scenes that would be amazing by themselves too over-the-top, you kind of have to design the scene around them.

Now rampaging Elephants, an unstoppable ogre, or a giant can make scenes more badass without going too far.

Not every badass scene has to include a dragon, in my story they would be rare, ancient and powerful creatures. Not some everyday thing that you run into on your way to buy some milk.

And in my opinion, that's the way it should be. From the sounds of it, your story will be just fine =D

So why is it that dragons (or devils or demons) are almost always the climactic challenge? Why couldn't it be say, a wurm? Or a manticore?

I'm not criticizing your choice to use a dragon, I'm just asking of the fantasy genre in general.

I think the reason dragons are typically used as the final hurdle a hero must face is due to their perceived power. It's a bit of a cheat, in fact. Everyone associates dragons with power, terror... Something you never, ever want to fight. No other fantasy creature has the sort of reputation a dragon has. An author who uses a dragon as his climax doesn't really need to bother with as much of the associated build up he would have to apply for any other foe.

As for a great story... One of the things people seem to forget about fantasy these days is the necessity of making it fantastical. This is why the protagonist for many stories is often a callow, inexperienced youth: Eldritch creatures and extraordinary locales are made all the more wondrous by the open-eyed innocence by which they can be viewed by an inexperienced young protagonist. By perceiving the world through his or her eyes, what may be mundane to some of the characters in the world can be made magical.

Though speaking of magic... It should only rarely be codified in the story itself. Part of fantasy, at least for me, has been the magic associated with magic. If I understand everything, it robs the magic of it's potential to frighten or amaze. Fantasy doesn't necessarily have to be wizards and warriors and dragons. It can certainly contain these things, but there has to be more to it than simply filing the serial numbers off of a generic fantasy setting and tossing in your own characters.

Just my own two cents.

I believe I've become a little cynical about the fantasy genre as a whole, from where I stand the same thing essentially happens over and over again. Giant dragon laying waste to the world? Don't worry, the dashing knight in shining armor is here to kill it. Necromancer brought your lovedones back as zombies and are trying to kill you? Never fear the amazing wizard is here to save you with his uber haxors. The death of a comrade loses its shock value because hell, you could bring him back with a spell. Things are simply too easy. The one fantasy story did not have magic at all, simply the creatures and lands of the fantasy.

Not to say there aren't good fantasy novels, hell there are great fantasy books out there. But there are so many authors who copy and paste that same exact story down that dilutes the awe of the novel. I admit to it myself, I've written my share of Dune and Tolkein knock-offs.

R.A. Salvatore is a good writer to study if you want to incorporate well thought out action sequences - his later works that is. It took his writing some time to mature.

And, as difficult as this may be, most fantasy novellas and stories, in general, are filled with cliche' and corny dialogue. Obviously, you'd want to stay away from that as well.

So I took Davids advice and wrote something, it's not nearly finished and could be the begining of a long story, one wich I will probably never finish writing. Before you read this and critize, please keep in mind that I have zero experience in writing. Also I'm swedish and havent even read a book in english, so please excuse any spelling mistakes made. Please do correct me tho, it's the only way to learn. It's only a big piece, but I didnt find any good place to split it up so it has to do. I hope you like it. =)




A chilly wind was blowing in from the east. Delias was sitting on the top of a curch, following the moon with is eyes as it progressed over the starfilled sky. He had already ate and didnt posess any lust for more blood tonight. Delias had only been a vampire for a little less then a decade but was already a well known among his kindred. As would anyone who had been choosen by the great Gasita. Dalias came from the noble family Belmoth, as did Gasita. For more then a thousand years, ever since he became a vampire, Gasita had watched over his lineage, and every few houndred years or so he picked someone from the Belmoth family to become a vampire. That was how Delias had became a creature of the night. He had awoken one night with a sudden urge to go out to the balcony. He didnt once question this urge as he walk down the hallway to reach the balcony, it just feelt natural. When he steped out into the dark night he was stunned by scenario that layed out before his eyes. The sky was clear and the stars burned brightly, the moon was big and had a yellowish color. It was truly beautiful, he could still remember it clearly to this day. He steped forward toward the balcony ledge, still staring at the sky. Delias had always liked the night better then the day, everything was so peaceful and quiet. He listened to the crickets playing their symphony of the night for a while untill he decided it was time to go back to bed. When he turned around to go inside there was a man standing there, looking at him. Delias flew back against the ledge, suprised and scared. The man just stoud there, quietly watching him. As he tried to calm himself Delias looked at the man. He was a tall man, with long white hair, almost like silver that fell down over his shoulders. He wore a long black coat that seemed to make him blend in the with night, if hadnt been for his silver hair he would have been hard to spot in the darkness. He had a sharp nose and a pointy jaw, he could have had a gentle look if it wasnt for those eyes. Reflecting the moonlight they seem to burn like blue flames, burning Delias as they layed on him, burning through his flesh and touching his soul. Delias thought to himself that those couldnt be the eyes of a human. The man suddenly spoke. “I have not come to hurt you Delias.” His voice made chills run down Delias spine. He tried to calm himself and bring forth courage to speak up. “How do you know my name?” Delias said with a shivering voice. “I know more about you then you do yourself. I am Gasita, have you heard of me?” He had heard his parently speak of that name, they had said that Gasita was the guardian of the Belmoth family. “I’ve heard my parent say that Gasita is the guardian of our family, is that you?” Delias tought he saw a brief smile on the mans face before he said: “I’m not a guardian, I do not guard anyone, I merely watch, but yes, I’m the one whom your parents speak of. I’ve summoned you here tonight to make a proposal.” Guardian or not, Delias still didnt trust this man who had apeared before him. “What kind of prosal would that be?” Delias said with a suspicius tone. “I wish to grant you eternal life, in exchange you have to walk the night as a vampire for eternity never feeling the gentle touch of the sun against your skin again.”

Good stuff, would you like me to edit it?

I would love that, if you could spare some time for a feeble atempt at writing as this.

It won't take too long, though I might not get it up until tomorrow.

ZING. My new sig.. thanks, Dave.

So do you guys think I should continue writing this story?

I should have clarified, I had a dentist's appointment and wasn't sure if I could make it back to the computer.

Fyntic - definitely keep it going. I'm an english major - creative writing minor, so obviously you have my support.

David - I love my new sig.

Here you go, keep in mind that my skills in punctuation are lacking at best:
___

A chilly wind blew in from the east. Delias sat at the top of a church, following the moon with his eyes as it progressed over the star-filled sky. He had already eaten and didn’t possess the thirst for more blood tonight.

Delias had been a vampire for a little less then a decade but was already a well known among his kindred. As would anyone who had been chosen by the great Gasita. Dalias came from the noble family Belmoth, as did Gasita. For more then a thousand years, ever since he became a vampire, Gasita had watched over his lineage, and every few hundred years or so he picked someone from the Belmoth line to become a vampire. That was how Delias had became a creature of the night. He had awoken one night with a sudden urge to step out onto the balcony. He didn't once question this urge as he walked down the hallway to reach the balcony, it just felt natural. When he stepped out into the dark night he was stunned by scenario that laid out before his eyes. The sky was clear and the stars burned brightly, the moon was big and had a yellowish color. It was truly beautiful, he could still remember it clearly to this day. He stepped onto the balcony ledge, still gazing into the sky. Delias had always preferred the night to the day, everything was so peaceful and quiet. He listened to the crickets playing their symphony of the night for a while until he decided it was time to go back to bed. When he turned around re-enter the house he was startled to discover a man standing in the doorway, looking at him. The man just stood there, quietly watching him. As he tried to calm himself Delias looked at the man. He was a tall man, with long white hair, almost like silver that fell down over his shoulders. He wore a long black coat that seemed to make him blend in the with night. If hadn't been for his silver hair he would have been hard to spot in the darkness. He had a sharp nose and a pointy jaw, he would have had a gentle look if it wasn't for his eyes. Reflecting the moonlight they seem to burn like blue flames, burning into the younger man as they laid on him, burning through his flesh and touching his soul. Delias thought to himself that those couldn't be the eyes of a human.

The man suddenly spoke. “I have not come to hurt you Delias.” His voice made chills run down Delias spine. He tried to calm himself and bring forth the courage to reply.

“How do you know my name?” Delias asked with a shivering voice.

“I know more about you then you do yourself,” replied the vampire. “I am Gasita, have you heard of me?”
Delias had heard his parent speak of that name, they had said that Gasita was the guardian of the Belmoth family. “I’ve heard my parent say that Gasita is the guardian of our family, is that you?”

Delias thought he saw a brief smile on the mans face before he said: “I’m not a guardian, I do not guard anyone, I merely watch, but yes, I’m the one whom your parents speak of. I’ve summoned you here tonight to make a proposal.”

Guardian or not, Delias still didn't trust this man who had appeared before him. “What kind of proposal would that be?” Delias asked with a suspicious tone.

“I wish to grant you eternal life, in exchange you have to walk the night as a vampire for eternity never feeling the gentle touch of the sun against your skin again.” Gasita replied with a slight smirk on his pale face.
-----

If what I've done doesn't follow your style then I urge you to change it back.

Okay, so I think this is the first chapter of this story. This is purely made to train my writing abilities, so please dont be afraid to critize. This chapter is only made to build up what's to come, and I hope I can make it more exciting and more of a "page turner" as I continue the story, please bare with me. =) This is all made up on-the-go by the way, I only have some small idea of what's to come, but I hope to be able to fill it out with some worthwhile content. I still dont know how to chop it up, it's a pain to read a big chunk of words like this and most people who comes by this will probably be scared away by it, so any suggestions is very much apreciated.

Edit: Nicely edited by David. Thank you. =)

Chapter One

A chilly wind blew in from the east. Delias sat at the top of a church, following the moon with his eyes as it progressed over the star-filled sky. He had already eaten and didn’t possess the thirst for more blood tonight.

Delias had been a vampire for a little less then a decade but was already a well known among his kindred. As would anyone who had been chosen by the great Gasita. Dalias came from the noble family Belmoth, as did Gasita. For more then a thousand years, ever since he became a vampire, Gasita had watched over his lineage, and every few hundred years or so he picked someone from the Belmoth line to become a vampire. That was how Delias had became a creature of the night.

He had awoken one night with a sudden urge to step out onto the balcony. He didn't once question this urge as he walked down the hallway to reach the balcony, it just felt natural. When he stepped out into the dark night he was stunned by scenario that laid out before his eyes. The sky was clear and the stars burned brightly, the moon was big and had a yellowish color. It was truly beautiful, he could still remember it clearly to this day. He stepped onto the balcony ledge, still gazing into the sky. Delias had always preferred the night to the day, everything was so peaceful and quiet. He listened to the crickets playing their symphony of the night for a while until he decided it was time to go back to bed. When he turned around re-enter the house he was startled to discover a man standing in the doorway, looking at him. The man just stood there, quietly watching him. As he tried to calm himself Delias looked at the man. He was a tall man, with long white hair, almost like silver that fell down over his shoulders. He wore a long black coat that seemed to make him blend in the with night. If hadn't been for his silver hair he would have been hard to spot in the darkness. He had a sharp nose and a pointy jaw, he would have had a gentle look if it wasn't for his eyes. Reflecting the moonlight they seem to burn like blue flames, burning into the younger man as they laid on him, burning through his flesh and touching his soul. Delias thought to himself that those couldn't be the eyes of a human.

The man suddenly spoke. “I have not come to hurt you Delias.” His voice made chills run down Delias spine. He tried to calm himself and bring forth the courage to reply.

“How do you know my name?” Delias asked with a shivering voice.

“I know more about you then you do yourself,” replied the vampire. “I am Gasita, have you heard of me?”
Delias had heard his parent speak of that name, they had said that Gasita was the guardian of the Belmoth family. “I’ve heard my parent say that Gasita is the guardian of our family, is that you?”

Delias thought he saw a brief smile on the mans face before he said: “I’m not a guardian, I do not guard anyone, I merely watch, but yes, I’m the one whom your parents speak of. I’ve summoned you here tonight to make a proposal.”

Guardian or not, Delias still didn't trust this man who had appeared before him. “What kind of proposal would that be?” Delias asked with a suspicious tone.

“I wish to grant you eternal life, in exchange you have to walk the night as a vampire for eternity never feeling the gentle touch of the sun against your skin again.” Gasita replied with a slight smirk on his pale face.

Delias just stood quietly as he tried to take in what the man had just said. Vampires? Ridiculous, but that man doesn’t look human, that’s for sure. “Vampires, is this some kind of bad joke?” As he said this Delias started getting angry, building up courage from this new anger. Who’s this man who comes to me in the middle of the night spitting out nonsense?

“I can assure you, this is no joke. I offer you the dark gift, you have been chosen.” As the man finished speaking he disappeared from Delias vision and he suddenly felt a strong hand lifting him up from behind.

“What the fuck are you doing? you piece a shit.” Delias felt angry, he felt confused and most all, he felt afraid. No normal person could lift him up easily with just one hand. The man had now turned him around so that he facing him, holding him high up in the air by his throat. Delias was struggling to get down, struggling to breath.

“I will return in a week, think over what I have said and have your answer ready for me when I return.” He suddenly pulled Delias close to him and he could briefly feel the mans breath against his neck before the abomination sunk his teeth into him. The feeling of being fed upon is difficult to describe, it’s a feeling of pain and ecstasy together with a sense of feeling powerless. The shock of suddenly being able to breath again and now having his blood sucked out of him became too great for Delias and he passed out. Gasita was gone.

Haha, sorry David, we where posting at the same time, didnt see your edited version before I posted.

It's all good, I'll just finish up the bit I haven't edited yet.

EDIT: and there it is:


Delias just stood quietly as he tried to take in what the man had just said. Vampires? Ridiculous, but that man doesn’t look human, that’s for sure. “Vampires, is this some kind of bad joke?” As he said this Delias started getting angry, building up courage from this new anger. Who’s this man who comes to me in the middle of the night spitting out nonsense?

“I can assure you, this is no joke. I offer you the dark gift, you have been chosen.” As the man finished speaking he disappeared from Delias vision and he suddenly felt a strong hand lifting him up from behind.

“What the fuck are you doing? you piece a shit.” Delias felt angry, he felt confused and most all, he felt afraid. No normal person could lift him up easily with just one hand. The man had now turned him around so that he facing him, holding him high up in the air by his throat. Delias was struggling to get down, struggling to breath.

“I will return in a week, think over what I have said and have your answer ready for me when I return.” He suddenly pulled Delias close to him and he could briefly feel the mans breath against his neck before the abomination sunk his teeth into him. The feeling of being fed upon is difficult to describe, it’s a feeling of pain and ecstasy together with a sense of feeling powerless. The shock of suddenly being able to breath again now having his blood sucked out of him became too great for Delias and he passed out. Gasita was gone.

I like your editing alot, it makes the story alot more reader-friendly. I also liked the small changes you made.
I think I'm gonna hire you full-time. Haha. =)

I charge $1.50 a page, more if I don't like your story.

I pay you once I get published, how's that for a deal?

Sounds good, you owe me $3 by the way.

Haha, nah, that was more like one page cut up in two pieces. Else I have to start giving you the material in large chunks of text to try and cut down on the editing fees. lol

It was 2 pages on my Word document.

Okay okay, fine, it's two pages, and I owe you 3$. I think I'm gonna have to start reading some english books if I'm to continue writing in english.

Might be a good idea, I suggest Dune

If I may make another comment as a whole, it was mentioned earlier that part of what makes fantasy so wonderful is the "fantasticalness" of it all, often through the eyes of an innocent protagonist. For the life of me, I can't remember who said it, and I don't feel like hitting the back button to look at the first page.

I would suggest keeping the past-tense to a minimum, and stick to present-tense. Not that it's bad by any means, it just gives us a better view from the young hero's perspective. Well, that's my opinion at least. I'm not exactly Charles Dickens myself, so I hope I haven't come off as snooty, I was just making a suggestion.

Third person omniscient or limited is a good place to start out, I've learned from experience that it's hard to write a good novel in first person at least until you've had practice.

Third person omniscient I understand. I was referring to tense, not POV. I actually like Third person omniscient a LOT for the fantasy genre. It makes it a lot easier to explain the laws of the realm, and the overall vast-ness of the environment.

I really wasn't responding to your tip, just adding one of my own.

Then I was elaborating and agreeing.

I think I've come close to the conclusion that I'm not that great at backing myself up.

Then I'll follow you around and do it for you.

That sure sounds creepy David. =)

Perhaps, but nto a creepy as Rae wearing Hunter as a hat.